Posts by Half banana

212

Why Do You No Longer Believe in God?

by Tenacious in

i know this question has popped up from time to time but i really would like to know how you guys, those that no longer believe, came to that conclusion?

was it the wts and all its crap?

was it something you read?

Half banana

Tenacious, perhaps you cling to God as if there is some mystical paternalistic force that however bad things get... you will make it to safety?

Here is the crunch point as every atheist knows; we have only our self to rely on. This might be hurtful to contemplate for the first time having believed in God but ultimately... and unlike children... we are all alone. Realising this is the reason we could experience anxiety in letting go of our deeply cherished notion. However a great freedom and expansion of our horizons begins once we take control and responsibility for our own lives.

The concept of God is a primitive myth which answered every question asked back in those days at the cradle of humanity. Times have changed and we have mainly resorted to knowledge to guide us rather than superstition. For the individual this is the big leap; to become our own person, not superstitious, not dependent, determining our own will and discovering the practical and testable answers to those things we once thought were magical. If we believe in a god we are condemned to be forever children and beholden.

Like the Borg, it is certainly in the financial and power interests of religious bodies to gather individuals who remain infantilised and compliant in their fear and sense of obligation to an invisible and unprovable deity.

You asked how did we individually become godless? As for me it was as diogenesister suggests; reading philosophy. As a JW and pioneering I had realised that the figure of Satan was a crude theatrical device and later the idea of God began to appear shaky but it was reading Kierkegaard (a theist) and Nietzsche (an atheist) which rapidly dissolved my belief in a god. As a suggestion; do start with a primer in the subject should you be interested. For me one of the most useful and absorbing books ever written is Bertrand Russell’s History of Western Philosophy (long but easy to read!)

18

I figured out how Animals ended up on different continents.

by James Mixon in

animals made rafts out of logs that were knocked down by the great flood, i'm not.

sure about the kangaroo it's possible his pouch could have filled up with water and he sinked and.

how the crossed the ocean, that's something i'm working on.. then we have "if you don't believe in god you don't know right from wrong".

Half banana

I like the rafting kangaroos idea with inflated pouches steered by platypuses and loaded with koalas, wombats and every last and sundry other marsupial. Unfortunately there are teeny weeny problems with this.

Wombats are not noted for their open-sea navigation skills nor for that matter an ability to communicate with platypuses... and only female kangaroos have pouches. Never mind God must have only used pregnant kangaroo rafters with a special waterproof pouch seal and extra long gestation periods to give birth to males when finally back in oz. It must have been tough on the koalas getting used to the fish diet?

20

Some Recent U.K. Information ...

by The Searcher in

... just received!

london bethel: last year a couple in their fifties were laid off from bethel and made special pioneers.

in january they will be demoted to regular pioneers.

Half banana

It's possible to have more fun at a crematorium than listening to a circuit assembly programme.

26

Why doesn't God need a creator, while the Universe does?

by Bloody Hotdogs! in

i asked this question of a jw that called on me yesterday: "if the universe requires a creator, why doesn't god?

if the universe must have a beginning, why doesn't god?

he claims to have an answer, but it must wait for next time he calls.. i'm hoping you guys can give me a heads-up as to what he will say.

Half banana

Nobody is as yet in a position to say precisely how the universe came to be but God indeed does have a creator. God is the product of the human imagination.

54

Paranoia after today's Watchtower

by Truthexplorer in

boy oh boy did i feel paranoid at today's wt.

not only are we to watch our associations outside of the congregation, but also watch our associations 'within' the congregation.

this was emphasised by the wt study conductor.

Half banana

The neurosis they are recommending will soon get to the pitch where you will begin to have doubts about associating with yourself!

7

The mythical meaning of the “Lord’s Supper” was revealed to Paul by Christ, not by any man

by Doug Mason in

the following is from: christian beginnings, geza vermes pages 91, 92, 98.

paul inherited from his predecessors a second great cult practice, the communal meal, referred to as the breaking of the bread as well as thanksgiving or eucharist in greek.

as in the case of baptism, paul supplied a new meaning to the community meal and turned it into an imitation and repetition of the lords supper.

Half banana

When examining the "last supper" it is worth considering the ritual within the experience of Romans familiar with their favorite cult; that of the Great Shepherd and Saviour, Mithra.

Paul wrote in Antioch which at the time was a centre of Mithraism and in the first century with no Christian Bible available, Paul was in a position to dictate his personal vision and write it down. Posterity and the Roman Church deciding that his words would constitute the orthodox view.

Mithraism was a mystery cult in other words it was for initiates only, as in any such group the holy 'secrets' would have leaked out and the last supper of Mithras with its symbols for blood and body is a template for the Pauline version. This was part of the synchretising of dogma; the absorption of much of pagan belief and ritual culminating in the all embracing nature or "catholic" belief of the early church.

16

Attention Lurkers... Monday, October 1, 2012 is the 98th anniversary of Jesus' rulership!!!

by Calebs Airplane in

attention lurkers... monday, october 1, 2012 is the 98th anniversary of jesus' rulership!i'll just let the watchtower magazine speak for itself...october 1, 1914, on taking his place at the breakfast table in the brooklyn bethel dining-room, he in a strong voice denoting conviction announced: the gentile times have ended!

-watchtower july 15 1950 page 216 pargraph 1 those seven appointed times of the nations ended in the early autumn of 1914, about october 1. before then the good news of the established kingdom could not be preached.

-watchtower october 15 1955 page 623 paragraph 7october 1, 1914, is now more than forty-two years ago and the kingdoms fight at armageddon is fast nearing.

Half banana

When I read the sacred pronouncements of the leading lights of the WT org I am reminded of the total and utter waste of time it is to listen to that worthless corporation. EVERYTHING they say is either misleading or wrong.

35

When did the Great Crowd start forming?

by Vanderhoven7 in

i realize that rutherford received a flash of light regarding the identity of the gc in the year 1935, but that does not tell us when the crowd began to form.

what would be the earliest date?

any ideas or quotes from wt literature?

Half banana

Vanderhoven, Rutherford's flash of inspiration as you put it, has an interesting origin which I found in a book in the British Museum Library. (Religious Sects by B WIlson 1970 Wiedenfeld and Nicholson p.194)

I suggest there is no tangible evidence for such thing as a ”great crowd” or “other sheep” they are simply evolved religious fictions but the development of JW doctrine is interesting nevertheless ...truth on the other hand never needs to evolve.

Since dogma doesn’t grow on trees; it is nearly always borrowed from earlier versions, often recruited to serve a new purpose but in this case Rutherford stole the idea to meet the requirement of a failing older teaching about the 144k which was becoming implausible, for it was projected that soon there would be more than that number of JWs! How then to fudge the figures?

An earlier incarnation of two hopes was proposed by a Watchtower Bible Student called Alexander Freytag who after the failure of the 1914 teaching and the death of Russell, looked again at a new meaning in the scriptures. Being a threat to Rutherford's imperial power ambitions, Freytag was expelled from the organisation. As B Wilson put it:

"Freytag intending men to overcome death and separating after the 1914 disappointment, started a new sect based on altruism borrowing from Spencer and Kropotkin...i.e. health and millennialism, the law of just deserts".This included the groupings of a heaven-bound little flock (petite troupeau) and a great crowd (Armee de l'Eternel) who would live on earth.

This splinter group, which I believe still exists today in continental Europe, mangles Russellite teachings with a health-conscious, non-smoking life style. As with Russell and the Watchtower control, Freytag's death was marked by an acrimonious leadership takeover and yet further splintering.

Freytag's concept of 'two hopes' was hastily re-cycled to resolve a doctrinal failure in 1935 by the crapulent Rutherford.(I think crapulent describes him well!) Freytag’s doctrine was foisted on the newly named Jehovah's Witnesses... and the dumb sheep followed the drunken shepherd.

So there it is, Rutherford stole the idea of two hopes from an apostate.

7

Saved

by Stephanie Twist in

how can a person be saved?

do jw believe that we are saved through the blood of jesus?

bible verses?

Half banana

Ever since childhood I thought; who needs saving? What from? It's like wearing a hard hat and life-belt in the middle of the desert.

It's religious jargon for gullible believers. To believe you need to be saved, means you come under the control of others who can guide you to salvation whilst taking the contributions.

19

"New Light never contradicts Old Light, but simply adds to it"

by stuckinarut2 in

does anyone remember this classic quote from a society publication??.

i remember it has been quoted many times, but i cant find the reference.. if this comment is to be taken literally, it condemns the organization anytime there has been a complete changes in teachings and doctrine!

.

Half banana

Watchtower "new light" is so special that it can actually stamp out and replace old light completely, you know, trivial things like Bible teachings... So bright is this new light that it can in fact dispense with the Bible all together and direct people to the real hope for mankind: the JW organisation.

For those not familiar with JW org, it is a charity run by a group of amateur clowns for their own benefit.